Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?

rogue_ronin · 7 Jun 2021, 03:44

Long-time Linux user. Been wanting to move to a Librem 5 for a couple of years, and have held onto my somewhat debloated, de-googled Xperia M dual-sim forever while waiting. I have to move to something with VoLTE soon, and I want to get away from Google. It doesn't look like the Librem 5 is gonna be ready in the next couple months, so I'll have to wait longer for it. But I have to switch phones soon, mine is becoming increasingly less functional.

I'm writing to ask if anyone with experience using an F8132 dual-sim Xperia X Performance can tell me if it can meet the following minimums?

Calls over VoLTE with both sim-slots via T-mobile in the US?
text messages, MMS as a bonus
WiFi, cellular data would be a bonus
(it probably works if VoLTE works, yeah?)
camera takes photos, with flash. Torch would be a very nice bonus.
(Video not required, but sure I'll take it)
a decent email client and a decent web browser
has Contacts and Calendar apps that can sync via webdav (Nextcloud)

I don't really use my phone for apps/games, nothing more serious than an occasional game of FreeCell. Mostly just communication, and I need to keep my work and personal numbers separate.

Other suggestions are welcome, I'm not really up on recent tech with phones.

Aloha!

Lakotaubp · 7 Jun 2021, 04:16

@rogue_ronin Your mani problem will be that we don't currently have VoLTE. The rest is pretty much covered. MMS is an issue for some though.

rogue_ronin · 7 Jun 2021, 05:21

@lakotaubp I may not understand what's going on, honestly.

If I were to move to this device, using ubports, what would happen over the next year in terms of functionality?

I may have overstated my need for VoLTE, but I was under the impression that I wouldn't be able to make calls at some point.

Cellular data is something I have avoided using for years, to mitigate tracking and data leaks, but it would be convenient if I could use it on a Linux device that I trust...

Aloha, and thanks for any advice.

PS: if there is a reasonably available dual-sim phone that ubports supports that works with T-mobile in the US, please point me to it.

Lakotaubp · 7 Jun 2021, 05:37

@rogue_ronin I don't have this device or know that much about sims that work in the USA others however do and are using them. From what I have seen the X is a popular choice as a daily driver but you really need someone who use it for the full picture. Have a look through the other threads to do with the X and on the forum for more info especially on sims and providers that work in the US.

TotalRando · 7 Jun 2021, 17:00

@rogue_ronin VoLTE is a form of device-enabled enhanced calling on certain 4G networks as an additional improvement over 3G. (To be clear, it's not 4G itself. 4G works, so calls in the US are still nice and clear.)

Texts work fine, but MMS (picture texts) have issues with some carriers.

TotalSonic · 7 Jun 2021, 18:31

@rogue_ronin - lack of VoLTE support is acknowledged as a major hurdle that the core UT team wants to make a big priority in fixing - but it likely will involve a ton of work so there is no firm timeline as to when a fix will appear for it at this point. I am able to make calls on T-mobile via 2G no problem with UT running on my Volla Phone though, and apparently T-mobile will continue to support calling over 2G until around April 2022. So, fingers crossed for VoLTE support to get added before that point, but for now, you can make and receive calls on T-mobile network without VoLTE support.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

rogue_ronin · 7 Jun 2021, 20:33

@lakotaubp said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@rogue_ronin I don't have this device or know that much about sims that work in the USA others however do and are using them. From what I have seen the X is a popular choice as a daily driver but you really need someone who use it for the full picture. Have a look through the other threads to do with the X and on the forum for more info especially on sims and providers that work in the US.

Thanks for the advice!

@totalrando said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@rogue_ronin VoLTE is a form of device-enabled enhanced calling on certain 4G networks as an additional improvement over 3G. (To be clear, it's not 4G itself. 4G works, so calls in the US are still nice and clear.)

Texts work fine, but MMS (picture texts) have issues with some carriers.

So the current state of things is workable; I haven't used MMS for years, but maybe I will try with this device. Thank you!

@totalsonic said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@rogue_ronin - lack of VoLTE support is acknowledged as a major hurdle that the core UT team wants to make a big priority in fixing - but it likely will involve a ton of work so there is no firm timeline as to when a fix will appear for it at this point. I am able to make calls on T-mobile via 2G no problem with UT running on my Volla Phone though, and apparently T-mobile will continue to support calling over 2G until around April 2022. So, fingers crossed for VoLTE support to get added before that point, but for now, you can make and receive calls on T-mobile network without VoLTE support.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

Okay, 2g for calls, 4g for data, 3g is the walking dead, right? and most of a year to hope for VoLTE. That's good context. Thanks!

TotalRando · 8 Jun 2021, 00:23

@rogue_ronin just to be clear my phone has 4G calling; it doesn't have VoLTE (often called "HD calling"), but still miles ahead of 2G/3G.

rogue_ronin · 8 Jun 2021, 23:08

@totalrando Yeah? The marketing on this stuff is doing its usual job of confusing the uninitiated.

So calls and data already go over 4g? Then what is VoLTE for? Is it a frequency-band thing, where they're trying to move everyone to a particular one so they can re-use other bands?

I've read around this stuff over the years, but I only care about the details when it's time to get another one so I forget everything. And nowadays, corporate weasel-speak is the common tongue so it's very hard to parse.

TotalRando · 9 Jun 2021, 03:06

@rogue_ronin said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@totalrando Yeah? The marketing on this stuff is doing its usual job of confusing the uninitiated.

Indeed. VoLTE is part of the suite of 4G services. But it isn't 4G.

So calls and data already go over 4g?

And at the same time, so you can surf and call.

Then what is VoLTE for? Is it a frequency-band thing, where they're trying to move everyone to a particular one so they can re-use other bands?

Not to my knowledge; it is basically hardware based sound optimization AFAIK.

I've read around this stuff over the years, but I only care about the details when it's time to get another one so I forget everything. And nowadays, corporate weasel-speak is the common tongue so it's very hard to parse.

Yeah, the VoLTE thing was educational. I got to the point of paranoia thinking only 2G worked on UT until... I realized I hadn't changed the setting to multiple bands. Phone works fine on LTE, calls and data.

RobTheBold · 9 Jun 2021, 14:28

@totalrando And when you say "optimized," it's optimized for the carrier to be more bandwidth efficient to save them money, at the expense of not being channel agnostic like plain ordinary VOIP (packet-switched voice) would be. So the phone's h/w and s/w has got to dive deeper in the ISO stack for benefit of the phone company, and to the detriment of smaller players like, well, every phone OS other than the Big 2.

It might be a good time for everyone facing a 3G phase-out to consider a plan B, e.g. a VOIP service that provides a local phone number.

TotalRando · 9 Jun 2021, 15:53

@robthebold I'll defer to your knowledge on that. The 4G on my OPO sounds fine to me. Perhaps it can get MUCH clearer (not sure how) but I just take terms like "HD calling" as marketing gimmicks.

RobTheBold · 9 Jun 2021, 16:17

@totalrando HD calling is indeed a marketing thing, as you say. And like you, I find the voice performance on the OPO to be completely satisfactory. It's a perfectly acceptable daily driver, other than MMS annoyances like iPhone people sending pics in weird apple-only formats -- what's with that?

But, try this interesting experiment: Look at the notification tray at the top of the screen while your device is unlocked and idle. You probably see the "L" since you're on 4G/LTE and in a good coverage area. (And if not, try it when you are . . .) Now, make a voice call and watch the network indicator while call is in progress and then immediately after hanging up. (I just call voicemail, but humans are acceptable, too for this test.)

TotalRando · 9 Jun 2021, 17:19

@robthebold Ok, tried voicemail. Went to "H" and then back to "L". I assume it switched to WiFi?

Edit: ok that's HSPA, so like 3.5G. Sounds fine to me though.

rogue_ronin · 10 Jun 2021, 01:32

@totalrando thanks for the superb explanation, really assuaged my confusion.

I'm super-tempted now. But I also just found CalyxOS, and that is a very good compromise, too.

My only worry is having to do this all again next year or something...

rogue_ronin · 10 Jun 2021, 01:38

@robthebold said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@totalrando And when you say "optimized," it's optimized for the carrier to be more bandwidth efficient to save them money, at the expense of not being channel agnostic like plain ordinary VOIP (packet-switched voice) would be. So the phone's h/w and s/w has got to dive deeper in the ISO stack for benefit of the phone company, and to the detriment of smaller players like, well, every phone OS other than the Big 2.

That is undoubtedly true. We have to take these companies apart.

It might be a good time for everyone facing a 3G phase-out to consider a plan B, e.g. a VOIP service that provides a local phone number.

One thought is just to give up phone calls altogether and move to ip calling or whatever the term is. I really only talk to maybe 10 people, I can set up amazing peer-to-peer calls using vdo.ninja, or whatever I want to do that involves speech, including simple voice connections up to 256Kbps. Maybe something like Matrix?

RobTheBold · 10 Jun 2021, 02:53

@totalrando It's fine, and it works great, but only until the local carrier drops 3G completely (HSPA is a 3G upgrade to extend its lifespan). Although it's gotten pushed back a few times here, now it looks like sometime early in 2022 3G will disappear and I'll be SOL on UBPorts, SFOS, or any other small player that doesn't have VoLTE working. YMMV with your carrier's timeline, of course, but it's a question of when, not whether.

So data will still work on our "alternative" phone OSs, but not normal voice calling. This is what's got me nervous and unhappy.

RobTheBold · 6 Oct 2021, 03:38

@rogue_ronin said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@robthebold said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:
One thought is just to give up phone calls altogether and move to ip calling or whatever the term is. I really only talk to maybe 10 people, I can set up amazing peer-to-peer calls using vdo.ninja, or whatever I want to do that involves speech, including simple voice connections up to 256Kbps. Maybe something like Matrix?

I'd like to, but unfortunately for me, that just won't work. I don't have that many people I talk to regularly either, but they're my wife and sister, my elderly Mom and Aunt, my doctor, my dog's vet and veterinary dermatologist, the two pharmacies that handle prescriptions for the above people and animals, the school district that occasionally needs to tell me my kids are sick or need lunch money, the various parents of the kids' friends, and a few neighbors that warn me when travelling salesmen are headed my way. I can only think of zero of those that I could convince to contact me on a VOIP service. Not even my wife.

If 3G goes away without a voice alternative on one of my favorite non-iPhone and non-Android OSs, it's flip phone or back to the land line for me. A sad way to end the smartphone era.

rogue_ronin · 10 Jun 2021, 04:19

@robthebold look at CalyxOS. I'm thinking it's a good two to four year bunker, if I buy a 5g version of the Pixel.

Limited choices, but excellent privacy. It's not Linux, yeah? But better than anything I've had in years.

Still waffling. Might do CalyxOS, and then get the Xperia for fun and experimentation.

TotalRando · 11 Jun 2021, 19:12

@robthebold said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@rogue_ronin said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:

@robthebold said in Thinking to buy an F8132, can it daily drive?:
One thought is just to give up phone calls altogether and move to ip calling or whatever the term is. I really only talk to maybe 10 people, I can set up amazing peer-to-peer calls using vdo.ninja, or whatever I want to do that involves speech, including simple voice connections up to 256Kbps. Maybe something like Matrix?

I'd like to, but unfortunately for me, that just won't work. I don't have that many people I talk to regularly either.... I can only think of zero of those that I could convince to contact me on a VOIP service. Not even my wife.

Not that I am advocating for this (I'd prefer to see the VoLTE problem resolved) but in theory you wouldn't have to. I am not sure what level of development Linphone is at on UT, but then you could just get a phone number through a SIP provider and plug it into Linphone. I presume you might even be able to port the number.