xmpp Messenger ??

4carlos · 19 Feb 2021, 05:20

Is there a usable xmpp messenger? Kaidan is a joke and crashes on launch on the Nexus 5. I haven't seen any progress for almost 1,5 years and it shouldn't be in the store anymore. Will Kaidan be developed any further?

ConverseJS seems like the only option? Other distros offer something like Dino, Gajim, Chatty ...

Keneda · 19 Feb 2021, 06:07

@4carlos said in xmpp Messenger ??:

Other distros offer something like Dino, Gajim, Chatty ...

What distro are you talking about?
Postmarket OS, Manjaro or Mobian for phone, Pure OS... ?!?

PhoenixLandPirat · 19 Feb 2021, 10:42

@4carlos Kaidans last update was on the 2nd of februrary,
Kaidan still isn't the best XMPP app, but it is making progress, and improving and is constantly getting better, the reason you don't see any of it is because you're using it on Ubuntu Touch, which isn't currently supported.

https://invent.kde.org/network/kaidan/-/commit/aa22d59ffaa3fc679c4d6c2b6fc0870248eb8972

Keneda · 19 Feb 2021, 11:48

@phoenixlandpirat said in xmpp Messenger ??:

Ubuntu Touch, which isn't currently supported.
https://invent.kde.org/network/kaidan/-/commit/aa22d59ffaa3fc679c4d6c2b6fc0870248eb8972

QT actually being updated to 5.12 by Dobey, that could change in a few time thus ^^ ...

PhoenixLandPirat · 19 Feb 2021, 12:03

@keneda Unfortunatly it seems not, as even though we are moving to qt 5.12, Kadain is moving to qt 5.14

https://www.kaidan.im/2021/02/02/kaidan-0.7.0/#download

Keneda · 19 Feb 2021, 12:14

@phoenixlandpirat

poVoq · 19 Feb 2021, 13:09

Yeah, this is also one of my main pain points.

I ported ConverseJS as a stop gap and currently I can't even update it to a newer version from upstream, as the 1:1 chats in the mobile view-mode broke in ConverseJS 7.x (MUC work fine though and the UI is actually a bit nicer)

Kaidan is promising, but besides the qt5.14 issue it also does not support group chats (MUC).

I am currently thinking to setup my own Movim server and update the Movim app for UT (also broken right now). But you should be able to use Movim in Morph already.

You can probably also run Conversations in Anbox.

Ah and someone told me he is using a terminal based client successfully on UT, but I forgot which. Probably one of these two:
https://poez.io/en/
https://profanity-im.github.io/

4carlos · 19 Feb 2021, 13:57

@keneda Manjaro Phosh and Mobian. Yes, it's based on debian.

Keneda · 19 Feb 2021, 18:59

@4carlos
Those are "classical" distros for phone, uTouch is not.
Maybe uTouch is not what you need?

4carlos · 21 Feb 2021, 06:23

@povoq
converse.js (7.04) , https://conversejs.org/fullscreen.html

My experience: This page runs slow but well in the Morph browser. 1:1 chats even work with Omemo, MUC works without encryption but not with Omemo encryption. Attempting to send the message blocks further input. The message will not be sent. It only helps to log out and log in again. It looks like a bug in converse.js?

Anbox with Conversations is not a good alternative. Yes, we can use Conversations and Threema too, but Anbox only offers rudimentary capabilities. Sending files, pictures, emoji and so on is very limited There are no notifications either. A running Anbox container drains the battery quite quickly.

4carlos · 21 Feb 2021, 06:26

@keneda
Why should UT not be for me? The N5 with UT is in daily use. Dino and Gajim are not "apps" (kiddy word) written for a mobile system, they are full desktop applications. I have a Pinephone with which I test other distros. With the "scale-to-fit" option, more or less desktop applications that are offered in the repos run fine (Evolution, yeah!) with the Pinephone. Dino works great on PP.

I'm not complaining about UT, but about the fact that Kaidan was discussed some time ago and nothing more happens for UT. Kaidan is completely unusable on the Nexus and others(?). Something like that doesn't have to be in the open store. It's just frustrating and I ask for alternatives.

Edit:
Explanation: After installing Kaidan, I can log in and see my contacts. When I start Kaidan for the second time, it crashes. Only a reinstallation helps until the second start. In other words, it starts exactly once.

Keneda · 21 Feb 2021, 06:51

@4carlos said in xmpp Messenger ??:

Why should UT not be for me? The N5 with UT is in daily use. Dino and Gajim are not "apps" (kiddy word) written for a mobile system, they are full desktop applications.

uTouch is not for running full desktop applications, appart in libertine.
Did you try libertine to run those?

If you want ubports devs to port new XMPP messenger or update existing one, you might be disapointed. Their efforts actually is focused on core updates, like QT or 20.04LTS...

So if libertine doesn't fullfill your needs, in the meantime, you should stick to other FOSS OS.

arubislander · 21 Feb 2021, 08:57

@keneda said in xmpp Messenger ??:

If you want ubports devs to port new XMPP messenger or update existing one, you might be disapointed.

I am not sure the OP was actually expecting the core devs to fix the XMPP messenger situation in Ubuntu Touch, but merely expressing their frustration at the current state of affairs. However in case I am wrong, I would like to have mentioned the following.

In a thriving Open Source ecosystem, not everything needs to be on the shoulders of the few. The 'core devs' as they have come to be called work on exactly that: development of the core components of Ubuntu Touch. Any and everyone is welcome to join them of course. But this aspect of the project requires a particular skillset that one must either already posess going in, or be interested in acquiring.

Kaidan is a separate project with no ties or affiliation to, but quite obviously an appreciation for, Ubuntu Touch. Because of the latter they have taken the effort to package their project for our platform.

Even though there hasn't been an update to the OpenStore in over a year, the project itself is still in active development. But, as with so many Open Source endeavors driven by volunteers, they could use some help, particularly in the packaging department.
So why not think of ways to help the project forward, instead?

[EDIT: I scrolled back and read some of the messages, and also looked more closely to the Kaidan project page, and saw the QT 5.14 dependancy issue. Yeah, that is a major blocker. But what I wrote is still applicable in general]

poVoq · 21 Feb 2021, 11:35

@4carlos said in xmpp Messenger ??:

@povoq
converse.js (7.04) , https://conversejs.org/fullscreen.html

My experience: This page runs slow but well in the Morph browser. 1:1 chats even work with Omemo, MUC works without encryption but not with Omemo encryption. Attempting to send the message blocks further input. The message will not be sent. It only helps to log out and log in again. It looks like a bug in converse.js?

Yes, but that is using the full-screen viewmode, which is less broken in 7.x but really has a lot of small usability issues on mobile screens. That is why my port uses the specific mobile view mode of ConverseJS. This one works fine in 6.x (for the most part), but with 7.x it has the above mentioned blocking issues.

As for OMEMO in group-chats: that can work, but requires specific settings of the MUC, such as that JIDs need to be visible and it being set to persistance & members only etc. (I don't recall the exact settings right now).

4carlos · 21 Feb 2021, 18:26

@keneda said in xmpp Messenger ??:

@4carlos said in xmpp Messenger ??:

Why should UT not be for me? The N5 with UT is in daily use. Dino and Gajim are not "apps" (kiddy word) written for a mobile system, they are full desktop applications.

uTouch is not for running full desktop applications, appart in libertine.
Did you try libertine to run those?

Yes, I did. Dino as my favorite is not in the repos of xenial 16.04. It was added later.

@arubislander said in xmpp Messenger ??:

@keneda said in xmpp Messenger ??:

If you want ubports devs to port new XMPP messenger or update existing one, you might be disapointed.

I am not sure the OP was actually expecting the core devs to fix the XMPP messenger situation in Ubuntu Touch, but merely expressing their frustration at the current state of affairs. ]

Correct.

funk · 23 Feb 2021, 15:23

Hello everybody, I'm new here using UT for couple days now and I love it! Anyway I'm missing a decent XMPP client too, a lot. Having one would make my ancient N4 a "brand new" daily driver with a great pleasure. In my point of view - no offense - it would be much more logical to prefer decentralized and completely open source platforms instead of centralized ones, it would fit the overall philosophy much better. Especially these days, when crowds of users are leaving one centralized IM service to stick to another with naive hope that history won't repeat. In between all this XMPP is here for years, still the same and improving, surviving it's successors and - that's so important - self-hostable. I'm not a developer, just enthusiast, but I can imagine, how much work and effort it would take to make such client. Anyway I wanted to share my opinion.

Consider this post as a reflection of a kind and as +1 vote for a decent XMPP client (or a plugin for existing messaging app), the tighter integrated, the better of course.

Cheers!

villeneuve · 15 Apr 2021, 16:25

Hi,
I just registered to this forum because I coincidentally got a Sony Xperia X and was reading around which ROM to use on it. I was a nice surprise to see that there's a Linux OS for this device. Since it would be my daily driver my requirement is a fully working, OMEMO-capable XMPP-client. This isn't currently the case on Ubuntu Touch, so for now I'm going to install an Android ROM on it.
I now wonder though: Once Dino becomes more or less feature complete is it portable to Ubuntu Touch?

PhoenixLandPirat · 15 Apr 2021, 17:10

@villeneuve dino is gtk, gtk isnt very likely to be a good experience on ubuntu touch, and will probabky be harder to port.

Youll probably have a much easier time just waiting for another qt upgrade, then click packaging Kaiden, thatll be getting more feature full over time.

poVoq · 15 Apr 2021, 23:25

Just as a quick heads up on this topic. Movim (movim.eu) just today got a proof of concept e2ee OMEMO implementation (developed under a NLnet EU grant) and in general it works pretty well in Morph.
Push notifications will be a bit more tricky, but I think once I get my own Movim pod running (some stupid Nginx issues) I will try to update the existing UT Movim webapp.
So this should really improve the XMPP messenger situation on UT.

4carlos · 18 Apr 2021, 05:23

@povoq Great, this has the potential to fill the gap. Can you explain Omemo in more detail? How is it activated? I use the site https://mov.im and haven't found any hint of encryption there.