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@joelandsonja
I think this is a reflection of the nature of the FOSS world. As a systems administrator and software engineer over the years, I've seen a number of cases of what I call the Hero Model of software engineering. One person has the interest, the focus and the energy to develop a project. I've seen amazing free software developed that way. Of course, there will be many other cases of different people creating the solution to the same problem, but working separately.Look at the PinePhone forums. There are close to 20 different combinations of OS, window systems and other fundamental variables. Each has a small number of people working on many solutions to one problem. Add in all the phone models, and wow, I'm amazing anything gets done. There are a lot of heroes doing what they can. Compare that to Google or Apple, with all the engineers they have focused on one OS for a small number of phones.
I have a Nexus 4 running UBports. There are still things that don't work there. More generally, it's always amazed me that there isn't a mail client installed by default. Dekko 2 has been Experimental for a long time. Camera doesn't work. Other problems have been reported. This is an old phone which has pretty official-looking support in UBports. I don't think it's a daily driver.
I'd like to have Touch on my Moto G7 Play. Halium? Okay, I'll accept that. But, there are lots of problems with the result. I don't think that's a daily driver.
Many of the supported phones for UBports don't have everything working. Fairphone 2 is probably the closest functionally to the PinePhone. It is a six year old phone. Flashlight and hotspot are partially working. Battery life isn't great.
The installation process, the website, the apps all look great in UBports. Touch is a really nice looking and feeling phone OS. I keep trying it and will continue to do so because I remain hopeful.
For the PinePhone, Mobian is best for me. Import stuff doesn't work, like the camera (well), MMS. It's not a daily driver. But, for example, some things are better, like a lot from the NextCloud server syncs to the phone, but in Touch only the Calendar syncs.
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I would have to agree with the OP, I appreciate all the work put into Ubuntu by so few people as like a passion project, but putting the UBPorts name on the Pinephone and doing almost nothing to support just seems wrong. If anything UBPorts should be focusing almost all their energy on an alternative phone like the Pinephone rather than old Android phones as it would create viable third option completely different than iOS or Android.
I mean Nexus 5 is good, but its a decade old, yet runs Ubuntu Touch well other than maybe MMS. Pinephone could be huge if only it was supported and developed. Pinephone should be a priority, the true linux based phone.
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@olddh
It has been said many times that UBports is a small community with very limited resources.
If the UBports edition was the first one out that is not by accident.
Now there are a large community using Ubuntu Touch daily and needing replacement for decade old phones... Also this users community expect support for their OS.So the foundation is focusing on rebasing Ubuntu Touch to Ubuntu 20.04 because the actual 16.04 is not supported anymore.
It is the logical choice and it will set a working base for any major update to come including work on the PinePhone.
Patching stuff on a soon discarded code base is a waste of time and effort, upgrading so the upcoming work will be time proof was the choice made.No one is forgetting efforts on the Pinephone and it was again said by Dalton during the last Q&A. He needs to sleep, I want him to sleep so he can code better
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@olddh I think it's unfair to say that there's almost nothing done on UT for the pinephone. It's not fair to the countless hours of frustrations and hair pulling done by those who worked on it. The mainline devices is a huge task for UT and putting time and effort won't be enough. I think UT can benefit from other distros anyway and sone of them are much bigger communities than UBports.
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@olddh
Its okay to ask questions, its okay to voice concerns, but damn, try and run Ubuntu Touch on a Nexus 5 running Linux 5.10, and Wayland, and you'll be in a much worse state then Ubuntu Touch on the PinePhone.Like, you would have a brick if you tried to do anything like the PinePhone with the Nexus 5 because its probably more than double the amount of work, but also, its very dismissive of all the actual work that people like Dalton have put into the project, like, maybe you have to have a good eye, but everyone works extremely hard on the Ubuntu Touch project, and UBports has put in a HUGE amount of effort to support the PinePhone, more effort has absolutely been put into the PinePhone than the Nexus 5 by the core team.
I dont know if you realize this, but its rare that the Nexus 5, OPO, FairPhone, even OP3 get device specific updates, a lot of the time, they get ported, and then left alone until something breaks them, or there's something that hasn't worked for a while and someones just decided to work on it for a bit.
Anyways the whole team needs a break, they all need time off, a good week or so time of rest, to do whatever be that bowling, going for walks, just sleeping, watching movies, or playing video games, they deserve a lot for what they do and have been able to do, and the amount of work thats gone into the PinePhone is, well, commendable!
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@phoenixlandpirat Nexus 5 actually runs Ubuntu Touch way better. Simple things like calls and texts actually work. Most apps on the app store work too where few work on pinephone. My only nitpick that stops a Nexus 5 from being my viable daily driver is I couldn't get MMS to work. SO any group texts, I would get a notification, but wouldn't get the actually message, I tried everything to see if there is a fix, doesn't appear to be as the interface doesn't allow for me to get MMS working on Nexus 5.
But back to the Pinephone, calls, SMS, most apps, don't work. Yeah Pinephone is a newer device than Nexus 5 and is more advanced hardware, but Nexus 5 plays way nicer with Ubuntu Touch, not even close. And when I speak of apps, I am not expecting iOS or Android levels of support as its just the great work of volunteers in the UBPort community, one of my favorites that runs on Nexus 5 and not Pinephone is Weber. It turns a webpage into an app icon, simple, but very useful app to create icons for your favorite pages.
Basically so far, Ubuntu TOuch Pinephone is useless as a commincations device or phone right now. Yeah, you can web browse and do some other linux stuff, but its currently nowhere near being an actual phone, sure as hell is nowhere near a daily driver.
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@olddh Don't know if you've seen the trial MMS fix about five posts up in this thread.
Edit:
https://forums.ubports.com/topic/5100/the-mms-lost-story/133 helps if I put in the link
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@kugiigi UBPorts has a lot of good work where the Ubuntu Touch OS actually works well on many tablets and older phones. I used a Nexus 5 for months as my daily driver but gave up on it when I couldn't do MMS and many friends that I keep in touch with did a lot of group texting, I would get notified, but wouldn't get the actual messages. But SMS, I would be able to text one on one, no problem. Also phone calls and the camera worked. And most of the apps in the app store worked.
Pinephone? Even the bare essentials or prerequisite for calling a device a phone, as in any communication features like phone calls or texting SMS, none work on Pinephone. Using it as like a mini-tablet to do browsing and linux type stuff, its not bad at all, an improvement over Nexus 5 due to newer hardware.
I am contributing nothing to the community other than criticism in that I don't write code, apps, etc. But constructive criticism, I wish the work on UBPorts started with getting the phone communication features to work as the priority BEFORE focusing on all the other computer web browsing, bash terminal, etc stuff.
I would like to see Pinephone be a phone first before a portable PC/Tablet, if that makes sense?
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@applee all I can give is constructive criticism as I am a Linux novice and just adopted it in the last couple of years, I do not write code, apps, and can barely get by in the bash terminal, so I am not one of the great volunteers that has made UBPorts what it is. But my main criticism with Pinephone support is the device is branded as a UBPorts version, I am a realist, I know its a beta product right now, but when I read about features in browsing I think to myself, I really wish UBports worked more on prioritizing communication features, as in making it work as an actual phone before it becomes a portable PC/tablet. If it worked with phone calls, texting MMS and SMS, and browsing, thats all I would need to make it my daily driver. Its really all that matters.
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@lakotaubp might have to dig up my old Nexus 5 to test it. I mean other than MMS not working on it, it was a pretty serviceable smartphone with UT. Pinephone is nowhere near that.
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This thread is now very long and quite hard to follow (something that happenend to the MMS thread, see above link) and the main issues have been repeated in various ways by various contributors all making valid points of view. So it makes a good reference point as to the state and views on PinePhone developement to date 28/06/21. Specific new issues or questions can still be posted in the PinePhone sub category but I do think this thread has run it's course so will lock it. Once more thanks to all who have contributed to this thread in your normal friendly but robust mannor.
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L Lakotaubp locked this topic on
