Use Mattermost instead of Telegram to discuss about UT

Moem

@dpitti said in Use Mattermost instead of Telegram to discuss about UT:

For the sake of peace, please delete my texts from this forum.

I can't do that, only the moderators can do such things.

Keneda

@dpitti said in Use Mattermost instead of Telegram to discuss about UT:

For the sake of peace, please delete my texts from this forum.

There is no good reason for us to do such an extrem thing.
Just try to stay on topic and be kind each other.
Now you can delete your posts on this thread yourself if you want.

A Former User

@keneda Sorry that everything got mixed up when translating. No, okay, I also made mistakes, so it can stay that way or I will adapt the texts a bit to the topic.

Fla

Well Mattermost can be accessed with Morph even if it probably isn't as smooth as with Teleports.

Moem

@fla said in Use Mattermost instead of Telegram to discuss about UT:

Well Mattermost can be accessed with Morph

Okay, but that leaves the question of why we would want to.

TotalSonic

Looking into it further - seems also that Mattermost is a paid service once you go beyond wanting basic features and small numbers of participants. No thanks!!

Bocephus

@moem said in Use Mattermost instead of Telegram to discuss about UT:

why

Stupid suggestion. I'm certainly not ditching Telegram.

Fla

@totalsonic exactly like the whole gitlab stack, it is there business model, core is free (and clearly complete enough for a project like UT), and you may pay for premium features. Mattermost is the communication tool built to integrate with gitlab and the standard for developers allowing launch ci, be warned about new issues and merge request etc without leaving the chat. That's what I use at work for years, also now what we use at CERN and I can tell you it's a nice tool which would require less than 15min to be activated by the ubports sysadmins. But I guess I presented it wrongly and I know it's hard to make people change. At least I tried :face_with_tongue:
I would have liked to have opinions from the core team on that topic though.

wgarcia

I'm still longing for classical mailing lists with searchable archives (and the forums) for this project, and chats only for interactive non-permanent exchanges, but I'm an old guy and I lost this battle long ago. For me it is a pain to look for old information in the Telegram chat.

AppLee

@bocephus No need to be rude.
You can have your point of view. But that's no reason to give names.
People's suggestions are always welcome.

cliffcoggin

Why the desire to discuss UT on anything other than this easily accessible forum? I will never join Telegram/Signal/etc or anything requiring membership of a secret society. That strikes me as little better than Twitter/Facebook.

Keneda

@cliffcoggin
Plus on forums, everything stays and can be searched.

manland

Interesting debate here. Let me put my through in this discussion. But before who am I.

Hello i'm Romain a french dev which love UT (daily drive it since 1 year now). I'm also the mattermost mvp for version 5.11. And the author of the official plugin gitlab.

So I guess i'm legitime to talk about this subject

I think the main point of telegram vs mattermost is about open-source. Télégram is not open-source, mattermost is. Just like github vs gitlab.

But no, ubports fundation are not hosting it's own gitlab @Fla. We use the global instance gitlab.com which is not linked with a mattermost instance. So the effort to host one is necessary.

As all decisions I take every day, this is a table whith pro/cons:

Pro	Cons
open-source	need to be hosted
open api	no native app (they have react-native mobile app but react-native don't support ubtouch, they have eletron desktop app but electron don't support ubtouch :crying_face:)
self discoverable (channels about dev, QA...)	no publicly accessible (need to register in ubports instance)
notification possible	need dev in MM (not in ubtouch and the man power for our OS is already light)
lot of plugins to bridge	need lot of configuration
no spam bot	not more debate to add a captcha

As you can see, As much I love mattermost, we can't do all this stuff in short/medium time. Maybe in long, very long time

As an advice, this is how I considered moving to mattermost (but unfortunately no time now...):

buy a starter at 150$/year https://mattermost.com/pricing/
create all channels in it (general, dev, qa, os...)
bridge them to telegram (and why not matrix...) https://github.com/42wim/matterbridge
invite people to come

If after 1 year no one use this instance don't renew it and you have "only" loose 150$.

If you do that, and users use it, I'll dev a native mattermost app for UT (or at least a way to have notification from it :smiling_face_with_halo: )

TotalRando

@cliffcoggin I like the Forum and it works fine.

@wgarcia have you seen groups.io?

libremax

@fla Since your sentence about the situation in Russia and its consequences for Telegram is baseless, it would be good to cross it out to avoid spreading ~~fake~~ erroneous [I didn't mean that it was intentional] news on this forum. And then the discussion about Mattermost could take place under healthier conditions.

Lakotaubp

@libremax That has already been countered by both @AppLee and @TotalSonic quite comprehensively with the correct info that Telegram is nothing to do with Russia as a country. There may be others that also think the same thing so just crossing it out won't help and is a form of censorship in itself as it is not so much an attempt to spread fake news but a commonly held error. I feel it is much better to leave as is and let the conversation follow with all it's mistakes, corrections, suggestions and ideas.

libremax

@lakotaubp Crossing out an erroneous sentence is not the same as deleting it, and it allows the error to be kept for the record and corrected for the reader's sake.
Otherwise, readers who only read the first post or who do not link to the correct answers will continue to be possibly misled which is not a good thing.

Edit: I replaced the word fake with erroneous in my previous post because I never intended to imply that the erroneous nature was intentional.

libremax

This post is deleted!

Fla

@cliffcoggin & others about why not only a forum. Yes obviously for exactly this kind of topic (debate, announcement etc) a forum is perfect. But there are other use cases when you need live chat, debugging together with a user, preparing a release... Just jump in the Dev group or the Axolotl one in telegram and you'll see what I mean. And Mattermost would make all this groups much more discoverable.

That being said, sorry I didn't remember that ubports wasn't hosting their own gitlab, in that case obviously there is a bit more work to be done to put it in place and that's maybe not worth it at the moment (because I think the advantage is also to be self hosted, not to use a sass solution)

arubislander

@fla Self hosting is not really a viable solution for the Foundation. We mustn't forget that self hosting takes up a lot of time in set up and maintenance. Someone in the community could volunteer to do that though.